Music & Memory in Stranger Things

0:17 The Well, hello and welcome back to Camp Nowhere, a Stranger Things podcast. My name is Joel. And my name is Lauren. We are so thankful you are here to listen to us process all things. Stranger Things. In this episode, we will be focusing entirely on music and memory, particularly how this is a key plot device in the series. We'll take a look at the neuroscience behind this topic and make some biblical connections as well. Pro show. But first, as always, spoiler alert, if you haven't yet watched Stranger Things in its entirety, which is seasons one through 5, be warned we will be discussing a lot of spoilers, so go give the show a watch before giving us a listen.

1:06 For sure, for sure. So we can dive straight into our first segment here. Music and Memory and Stranger Things Music plays a key role in the show, hence one of the reasons I love this show so much. Really going all the way back to season 1 when Will is alone, cold and breathing in toxins and the upside down, he singing or humming his favorite song Should I stay or should I Go by The Clash is one of the only things that seems to calm him down and bring a sense of comfort. Why is this? Well, because that song reminds him of home and family.

1:46 He has memory of his Big Brother Jonathan showing him that song while they were bonding and trying not to think about their parents yelling at each other. Exactly, and then it becomes even more of a plot device in season 4. Vecna's curse is a metaphor for memory entrapment. Characters trapped in Vecna's mindscape often relive traumatic memories. Music becomes a lifeline, then that cuts through these mental strongholds. Which of course is iconically shown in the Dear Billy episode with Max using her favorite song Running Up That Hill by Kate Bush to escape from Vecna's mind layer.

2:29 Oh totally. Music can ground the mind. It re engages emotional and autobiographical memory networks, pulling characters back to the present and anchoring their sense of self. Robin and Nancy had gone to Pennhurst Asylum to talk with Victor Creel, who is Vecna's dad, to see if he might be able to help give them some insight and into how to free someone, in this case their friend Max, from Vecna's curse. On their tour of the asylum, they learned there was a whole room there called the Listening Room, which allows the patients to listen to music.

3:09 Here is a clip from that scene in Season 4, Episode 4 entitled Dear Billy. This is one of our more popular areas, the Listening Room. We found that music has a particularly calming effect on the broken mind. The right song, particularly one which holds some personal meaning, can prove a salient stimulus. Music really is so powerful. I mean, we can all relate to hearing certain songs that are tied to specific memories, good or bad. When I hear Really Anything by Jack Johnson, I'm instantly taken back to 7th grade trying to cope with my parents splitting up because that's the music I was listening to for comfort a lot during that time in my life life.

4:00 On the flip side, I have a dear friend who can't even bring herself to listen to Jack Johnson, specifically his song Better Together because she associates it with a dark time in her life and an abusive relationship. Or I think about when I hear the song Someone Like You by Van Morrison. I am instantly taken back to memories of crying on my way home from our first date since that song was playing in the car and I pretty much knew that Joel was the one, as well as our wedding day since it's the song we first slow dance to together.

4:36 Yeah. And then, after Robin and Nancy get busted for having pretended to be college students in order to get access to even speak with Victor Creole, Robin has an epiphany about how music really can function as a lifeline back to reality. Mr. said the night of the attack everything went on in the house, but he made specific mention of music. He said music was playing.

5:05 And then when we asked him about the Angel, he started to hum,

5:12 Say 99 and kiss me. Oh my, don't tell me A Little Dream. Yeah. Ella Fitzgerald, voice of an Angel, Yeah. Hatch said that music can reach parts of the brain that words can't. So maybe that's the key, a lifeline. A lifeline back to reality. It's worth a shot. Wow. Yeah, it's so true that music reaches parts of the brain that words just can't sometimes. It also has the power to create either a sense of safety or of danger, depending on how it is or is not being used. So in the same Dear Billy episode, when Max is fully in Beckman's mind layer, the sound narrows to an oppressive quiet.

5:52 There's distant rumbling, the voices slow down, and there's almost no melodic music, which makes her feel cut off from the rest of the world and from her friends. Love. As Dustin, Lucas, and Steve play her tape of running up that hill, the song cuts sharply through that silence, first as a faint echo and then as a full, loud melody that literally opens a visual portal back to her friends embodying music as a lifeline to reality and to their love for her. The scenes emotional reading from Netflix's own music supervisor notes that she's quote running from an evil representation of the absence of love and toward the overwhelming care and understanding End Quote of her friends, which the song makes audible in Season 2 episodes 4:00 and 5:00.

6:47 As the Mind Flayer is taking deeper and deeper hold of will, the dialogue around him will often drop out under like heavy, distant ambient music or his breathing and heartbeat become the only clear sounds for the audience. And this near silence and then plus the mind Flayer's like low rumbling. I don't even know what he would call it. And that combines to make it seem like something is actually speaking through Will, and that just cuts him off from the relational connections around him. And then, when Joyce and Jonathan use their home movies and family memories, the scenes reintroduce those warm, domestic sounds of like the whirring of a projector or overlapping voices.

7:41 And that makes the home's familiar audio world a counterpoint, like a foil to the cold, thinned out sound of possession. Yeah, yeah, those are great examples. I thought of a few more. So during the Snowball dance in Season 2 episode 9 entitled The Gate, the kids dance to the police's ever so famous song Every Breath You Take with loud lyrics, chatter, laughter, creating this full relational sound. And then the scene cuts to the Upside Down version of the school, and the music is sucked out and replaced by wind.

8:24 You mentioned, like, rumbling as the mind flare looms above the school. And that sudden removal of melody tells us that the joy point connection we just heard are really fragile. And yeah. And then in the general Upside Down design versus normal Hawkins sound designers have described the Upside Down as built with heavy filtering, long reverbs and reduced high frequency detail to make it feel empty, as if normal life has been like muted or turned down. In contrast, scenes back in Hawkins get full spectrum sound birds, chatters like since the synthesizer score.

9:10 So the move from quiet, murky Upside Down ambience to bright, musical Hawkins audio functions as a Sonic metaphor for moving from isolation and threat back into community and hope. It makes me think about what Max said in Season 5 Episode 4 entitled The Sorcerer. Music has a way of finding you even in the darkest of places. That's so true. We can all resonate with music, helping us cope with pain, darkness and anxiety. OK, I think we have a good foundation. So let's move into our next segment, the neuroscience of why music unlocks memory.

9:56 So here's a clip from the World Science Festival of Tufts University neuroscientist Anirudh Patel explaining how scientists study your brain's response to music and what parts of your brain are activated by different attributes of music. What is happening to our brains when we hear this music? Since about the 1990s, there have been colleagues of mine taking the same clip of film and then changing the music and asking what changes in the listeners, in the viewers perception of the of the movie when you change the soundtrack but keep the film the same.

10:33 And you know, the obvious thing we might all think is, well, you know, the emotions change because music is sort of intensifying the emotions of the film. But they found other a number of other things that have been really interesting. The music can it's not just intensifying the mood. The music and film can create expectations about events that might be coming up next, can lead to associations that aren't necessarily on the screen. Can tell if the story is resolved or not. Can change the way you interpret characters and their relationships in terms of what you're seeing up on the screen.

11:01 Can influence what you remember from a scene, the particular details you remember. And finally, just can really influence our sense of being inside the world of the film as opposed to being somebody watching a film from the outside. What did surprise us when we started to look at music in the brain using these techniques of neuroimaging, which allow us to look inside living brains without having to open up heads, was how much of the brain is activated by purely instrumental music? So no words, so you're not processing semantic meanings at all.

11:30 And yet when we look at the brain listening to music, we see widespread activations. This is from the work of a colleague, Professor Stephen Kulsch in Germany. And this slide is just showing regions of the brain that are involved in processing harmony, just one aspect of music. So this is not rhythm or timbre or anything else, it's just harmony. And, and the salient point here is that you see widespread activations on both sides of the brains and not just in the auditory centres, not just in the hearing centres, but in areas in the forebrain involved in abstract thinking and, and, and areas in the upper parietal cortex involved in spatial cognition on the right side of the brain as well.

12:07 So just one aspect of music can activate this much of the brain. If I started to overlay the what happens when you listen to rhythms and and and Timbers and so forth, you'd see a great deal of the brain being activated. So music is engaging many mental processes well beyond just emotion. Now you're looking down from above and different slices of the brain kind of marching your way down through the brain. And these the colored areas are areas involved in musical expectation. When you music sets up an expectation for something that's going to happen next in the music.

12:39 And again, you see not just the auditory centres, but widespread areas, the frontal cortex involved in abstract thinking, deep brain centres involved in emotion, left and right side of the brain. And so the picture that's emerging is that music is not just a powerful way to activate the emotion systems. It activates memory, motor control, imagery, attention, sequencing, spatial processing and abstract thinking. It's one of the most powerful ways we have of activating most of the brain. So to talk about that a little more, music activates multiple parts of the brain.

13:12 So there's the hippocampus, which is with memory, there's the amygdala where a lot of emotions come from and the auditory cortex. And it creates like a cross network communication between those different parts. And yeah, the idea basically is that because those different parts of the brain are all working together, it solidifies memory, it strengthens that. And so music can function like a mnemonic device to help with learning or memorization. Oh. Absolutely. And what better way to share that than this clip from the movie School of Rock?

13:53 The classic movie classic. Yes, when Jack Black uses music to spice up a math lesson. Well, well, what's that?

14:06 Oh, that, yeah, We were singing. We were singing and we were learning. We were learning in sing song. Huh. What are your methods? Mm Hmm. Yeah, I find that it's really helpful when you're teaching the subjects that are the boring subjects. Huh. Well, you don't mind if I just sit in on your class this afternoon, do you? No, no, come on back this afternoon. It is the afternoon I meant now,

14:42 so please just continue with your method. Yeah. OK.

15:00 Math is a wonderful thing. Math is a really cool thing so get off your athletes, do some math math math math math math 3 -. 4 is. -1 that's. Right. And six times a billion is. 6 billion. Nailed it. And 54 is a 45 more than What is the answer, Marta? 9. No, it's 8. No, it's 9. Yes, I was testing you. It's 9, and that's a magic number. Oh my gosh, I love that. He's like, I was testing you. It's not, and that's a magic. Number and the and the girl goes no, it's not so. So good. Yeah. So, yeah, to your point, when my youngest sister Leanna, shout out Leanna if you're listening, when she was about 7 years old, I taught her the 1st 10 numbers in Spanish through a little tune that I'd come up with.

16:31 And I checked in with her because I was curious, like, do you still? Yeah, I called her and I was like, I have a really random question for you. And she's like, OK. And I was like, do you remember that little song that I taught you in Spanish? And she's like, Oh my gosh, the one with the numbers? And I was like, yeah, like one through 10. I said, do you still remember that? And she's like, oh, I oh, yeah, I have it locked in. And she sang it for me. She still remembered it even though she had not sung that and who knows how long.

17:01 And she's 22 years old now, so I don't know how whatever math, but it's been a while. And, and, yeah, she still remembers. I yeah. And I also just want to interject that that Lauren has been working on a, a new playlist, which I don't know how often that really happens because of how many playlists that you have, but it's. Probably more than 100. Oh, it's definitely more, Yeah. And so yeah, it's it's a hobby for her. And yeah. And so a recent playlist that she made was throwback CCMS. So like throwback contemporary Christian music of like the 2000, a lot of it's like the 2000s or early twenty 10's.

17:46 And yeah. And I was listening to that playlist, and I felt like parts of my brain were just unlocking because there were all these songs that I grew up with, like, hearing on the radio, like in middle school or high school. And I would just remember the words. I would remember the melody, and I could sing it even though I legitimately have forgotten about the song since 2008. It's wild. Yeah. Yeah, that's crazy. And part of that unlocking of the brain also includes emotions. So like when we experience strong feelings while hearing a song, our brains will tie that emotion to the sound pattern.

18:28 So in a way, it's kind of like creating a stamp, like you're stamping it as like an emotion. Music tie emotional centers and the limbic system, including reward pathways, will release dopamine during familiar tunes, which reinforces that recall through pleasure and nostalgia, which we did a recent episode on. We did, we did. Check it out. Check it out and like an example of that is in The Lion King. So in The Lion King, Timon and Pumba's Hakuna Matata gives Simba a new carefree identity and memories which the song just perfectly captures.

19:10 Like when you hear Hakuna Matata, you feel carefree. Absolutely. And I mean, yeah, of course that's literally what the lyrics say. But like, even if you took the lyrics away and just listen to the melody, yeah, it would just make you feel at ease, for sure. Yeah. So there's that song. But also there's the song Remember Who You Are, which later jolt Simba back to his past, right? And there's that contrast that shows how music can both create and reactivate those autobiographical memories. And many viewers report feeling flashbacks to their childhood when hearing those themes.

19:52 Oh, and this is just a fun side note, but Caleb McLaughlin, who plays Lucas in the show, I think he got his start on Broadway as playing young Simba. Yeah, I'm the liking. So shout out, Caleb. Halo And so there's also music used as therapy. I mean, that could be a whole episode. But yeah, there have been studies with Alzheimer's and dementia showing that familiar songs can restore lost memories and help people to think more clearly and to reduce stress or anxiety. And so, yeah, I mean, a personal example would be like, I think of my grandmother, who had dementia in the in the later years of her life.

20:48 Yeah. And I remember I would like, go to my hometown for the holidays where my grandmother was, and I would see her and it would have been several months since I last saw her. And she didn't really know who I was, but she, I, I could tell from like her facial expression and mannerisms that she could tell that there was some sort of connection between her and I. I don't think she could have articulated that that I was her grandson, but that she knew that something was there. But I remember something that was sweet about our visits.

21:33 And also this goes back to when I was a kid, when my parents would take me to go see her. Even as a kid, one thing that I did was that I would always play the piano for her because I was taking piano lessons. And she would always ask, like, she would want to know what songs I was learning in my piano lessons. And so I would play them for her. And so, yeah, like in the in the later years of her life, I would play the piano for her. And it would be hymns that she grew up hearing throughout her life that she grew up on.

22:12 And they were, you know, the the old good country hymns when the role is called up Yonder leaning on the everlasting arms. I actually played that one at her funeral. But yeah, I would play those for her. And she would change. Like, she wouldn't. Yeah. Like she would just be able to sing along. She would remember some of the words. She would remember, like the melody, basically. But it's so interesting because she would remember that. But then sometimes, like during the visit, like later on after I got done playing, she would tell me like even on the same day, that one thing that she really liked was that there was some nice young man who played piano for her.

23:03 Like she like, even though she may have not remembered who I was, she remembered the songs and like the rich personal history that she had with them, like growing up in church as a young girl and singing those songs. The other tied to core memories. Yeah. For her, yeah. And yeah, and so, I mean, yeah, I think of that as a personal example where it helped her with memory. It also helped her to feel more at ease. Because if you do have experience with caring for people who have dementia or Alzheimer's, understandably, those that are suffering through that can feel just very confused and through that confusion can feel frustration or fear of just not really knowing, like, what's going on around them.

24:01 And like, these songs would help her to give her a sense of home, like to give her a sense, a sense of clarity of what? Yeah. And I remember, yeah. My parents would also, like, have DVD's of the Bill Gaither Band, like doing. I think it's precious. That's a throwback. Oh, yeah. Well, yeah. And I think it was called Precious Memories, I think. Yeah. And they would put that DVD on for her and she would sing along. Not to be confused with precious moments. I did. That was my first Bible. I had a precious moments.

24:37 Do you remember those things? I think so. I I would need, I would need a picture. OK. But yeah, but yeah, so that's an example, just a clear example in my personal experience of music being used to help someone who has Alzheimer's or dementia. Yeah, well, praise God that she had you to. They'll help her in that way. Yeah. Thanks for sharing that. Of course. And my mother too. Yeah, she would play piano as well. Yeah, Yeah. And so also with music there is rhythm and repetition. And so, yeah, I mean the so when you think about music having like certain words or rhythms or melodies that repeat, you can see clearly how that ties to memory.

25:28 Because with that repetition, that builds stronger memory. Yeah, it helps, especially YEAH with long term memory explaining why we remember song lyrics easily but we may struggle with spoken words. Yeah. See, now this is the type of science I really enjoyed studying if there's music involved. And that last point you made about rhythm and repetition is actually a great segue into our next segment, biblical and theological resonance. So God designed music to connect deeply with the soul. Like I, I firmly believe that there are several different Psalms in the Bible and other scriptures where Christians are called to worship God through song.

26:18 Some quick examples if you're curious and want to check it out for yourself, like Psalm 9590698101, 49150. There's First Corinthians chapter 14 verses 15 and 26, and then there's Hebrews chapter 2 verse 12, which actually quotes from Psalm 2222 are just yeah, just for the second time. I won't read them all, but highly recommend checking those out. And then Ephesians 518 through 21 and Colossians 316. In their God commands believers to sing psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs, a practice that unites emotional and cognitive memory.

27:05 So I wanted to give a shout out to this band I really appreciate. They're called the Corner Room. They're led by musician Adam Wright, and they set Scripture primarily, like verbatim from the ESV translation of the Bible. They set that to music. And the purpose is to create accessible songs that help believers and followers of Jesus engage deeply with, memorize and treasure God's Word through worship and meditation. Yeah, they've got like a whole set of that with the Psalms, you know, Isaiah, Messianic prophecies, First Corinthians 13.

27:49 I think there's like parts of the Gospel of John. And then there's like Christmas themes, scripture collections as well. And for me, listening to their music on repeat, like you mentioned, repetition truly has helped me memorize different passages of God's Word. And it makes sense, right? Like, it's the same reason you can, you can hear a song that you haven't heard in like 15 plus years and then it comes on the radio or, you know, you hear it when you're out and about and you can still sing most, if not all of the lyrics.

28:23 And you're like, what is going on here? But it's because it, yeah, it really did get coded into your long term memory. Joel. Didn't we read something kind of related to that recently in the devotional we've been going? Yeah, yeah, we did. Yeah. Paul David Tripp, a pastor and an author, says this in his devotional Everyday Gospel. I grew up in a singing family. My sister played the piano and I think my mom had memorized the entire hymnal. I grew up singing the great hymns of the faith, and I can still sing most of them without looking at the written words.

29:00 I'm thankful for the world of song. Songs give wings to the emotions of our hearts. With songs we celebrate and with songs we mourn. With songs, we remind ourselves of who we are and who God is. Songs commemorate huge victories and dark defeats. But the thing I like best about songs is their ability to paint in our minds deep truths of of the Word of God in ways that are beautiful and memorable. Some of the most beautiful and penetrating theology ever written is found in the great hymns of the church.

29:33 I love that the church will never stop writing and singing new songs of God's glory and redeeming grace. God's grace should make you sing. What better songs could you sing than once about His power, His mercy, forgiveness and love? Yeah, I love that. OK, so God is the God of science. He is the one who created us. And so he knew the effect music would have on our brain chemistry and neurological pathways. No wonder he would command us to sing spiritual songs. For sure. Here's some other related points.

30:10 Music as spiritual formation. So a devotional that Lauren and I really enjoy and that Lauren texted me this morning about how great it was, was a devotional called Sing that Shane and Shane. I don't know which Shane does it, but it's one of the. And it's like with the worship initiative as well. Yeah, it's the yeah. And so one of the Shanes does it or is leading it, you know, like the main singer shame, not the shame that sings the women's part, like the high women's part, but like the melody person, right.

30:47 Yeah. I'm like, Sir, I don't know how you sing that high. But anyway, that's besides the point. There's this great devotional that they do every weekday where they basically want to make singing the truth of God's Word an essential part of their daily devotion to Christ. Sorry, that's just what they say. Yeah, but that see that shows that repetition will like wire that into your memory I. Remember that and they. Use Colossians 316 as their basis for that. Exactly. Yeah, yeah. And so they use that point and the connection that they make like that they reiterate every time, is that the command to sing psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs is a way for the earlier part of the verse to happen, which is may the word of Christ dwell in you richly.

31:42 So like let the word of Christ dwell in you richly. And one of the ways that you do that is by singing psalms, hymns and spiritual songs. Yeah. Singing embeds doctrine and scripture into believers memories. And doing that transforms theology from this arbitrary thing into an experience that's embodied. Yeah. Moving from orthodoxy, which is correct belief, to orthopraxy, which is the correct practice of the correct action. And of course there's also the community aspect where as believers we are commanded to sing together.

32:25 So not just individually but also together. So this groups singing even like synchronizes heart rates and breathing and that helps with social connection, which reflects the unity of the body of Christ.

32:44 And yeah, also with this as, yeah, as believers, we understand that there's not just the mind that is involved in faith, but there's also the heart. And we're not just talking about memorizing things, but also faith. And so, just as Max's song helps her remember who she is, songs of faith remind Christians who they are in Christ when fear or doubt or lies from the enemy may threaten to overwhelm. Music is a divine gift that helps us remember truth when we're lost in mental darkness or having trouble getting out of our heads.

33:26 Oh yeah, absolutely. I love that. And music has been used through the centuries kind of as an anthem to fight against prejudice, injustice, racism, evil, etcetera. And it's been used as a strategic tool to remind us of truth, our true identity, and the goodness of the God we worship. So just so everyone listening knows, Joel actually has perfect pitch and he has something called chromesthesia, which is a type of synesthesia in which hearing sounds, especially musical notes, instruments, or voices, automatically and consistently triggers the experience of colors, shapes, or movement in the mind's eye.

34:14 So, for example, when Joel hears certain musical notes, he actually can see different colors associated with them. So it's kind of like a superpower, basically. So Joel, I'm curious, have there been times when the colors you see in music felt like a kind of sacred experience or closeness to God? What was happening with the music and your memory at that moment? Yeah, Yeah. That's a great question. Yeah, I think, I don't think I have like a particular memory in mind necessarily ironically, because we were talking about memory.

34:59 But but there are definitely been moments where I would be at church either like singing in the congregation or I was on the worship team and the, you know, the synesthesia would happen and I would like think of colors. It doesn't blind me, but it just comes to mind. And I, and it just causes me to worship God more deeply just because it makes me think of how beautiful and wonderful God is that he would give the different gifts and abilities to, to different people. And it makes me wonder like, how are we going to experience, experience God like and worship in heaven, You know, because there are things here that will be in heaven and things here that will not be.

36:02 And one of the things that we know that will be there is music, right? Because yeah, in Revelation, one of the primary ways that the angels and creatures are communicating to God is through singing. I know, and I'm just really excited that it will be in all different kinds of languages. And styles. Like, it's not like, listen, nothing against Chris Tomlin. He's great. He's on that CCM throwback playlist you mentioned earlier. But like, heaven's not only going to be just like, Anglo-Saxon type, you know, Chris Tomlin song only for all of eternity.

36:42 Like it's gonna be just, yeah, like an array of all different kinds of styles and languages of people worshipping God, which is so exciting. Yeah, yeah, and I mean like even different instruments, I'm curious about what the instruments are gonna be. Yeah, cuz I'm sure like they're, I mean because I think Revelation mentions horns. So like there will be some that are similar to for sure what we have, but I'm curious what what other things there will be, you know, And as far as like how chromesthesia like effects memory for me.

37:23 Yeah, like, yeah, like Lauren mentioned that different musical notes have different colors associated with them. And the reason that I associate them is primarily because of memories. And so so yeah, like the note a like an A the pitch a like someone plays an A that is read to me and the. Scarlet Letter.

37:52 Honestly, that might like subconsciously be a part of it. I'm just kidding. Yeah. I was like, I don't know. That subconsciously may be a part of it, but the but the core memory that I think of is, I think it was maybe in middle school or I might have been younger, like 5th or 6th grade. I'm not sure. But but yeah, I had one of those. I was taking piano lessons and I had one of those Faber books. I think if you know, you know, it's one of those like children's piano books where you would have like the different songs and they would teach you a different technique with each song and there would be an illustration with most of them.

38:32 And so I remember 1 near the very back of the book that I had at the time was a romantic waltz. And it was a core memory because I was learning that song and my mom really liked it. And so one time she asked me to play it and my mom and dad slow danced like in the room, like while I was playing the piano. And what was the illustration of that was there for the song arose. And so I think of Red when I think when I hear like a song in a major, I hear the note A. And so then for me, I knew that when I wanted to propose to you, Lauren, that I wanted to write a song in that key.

39:29 And so the song that I wrote to propose to you is an A, because that is, I just have strong room, like romantic ties to that and so. That's also really sweet because the song is called With the Leaves and it's kind of meant to sound like autumn. Yeah. So a. Yeah, yeah. And it's really beautiful. It's become one of my favorite songs. Yeah. And red is a color associated with fall. Yeah. So that works. So yeah, Anyway, so there's that. And now we move. To our final segment, which is the Lightning round.

40:17 So I answered questions in the last episode. So now it is time for Lauren to answer. And we begin with #1 do you choose music or silence when you're overwhelmed? I I think it depends on the circumstance of which I'm overwhelmed. I say that because like imagine, you know, I'm driving traffic is crazy and or I'm kind of lost, like I'm not sure where I am or just like there's a bunch of sirens around me or something. In those type of scenarios, I find myself turning the music down or off. It's almost like I for some reason think that, you know, if I like, if I'm lost, that if I turn the music down all of a sudden I will understand the directions or something.

41:08 Yeah, it's. I don't know why I do that. There's like a there's like a quote or a meme or something where like you're trying to navigate and you don't know where you are. And the meme's like, turn the music down. I can't see. Yeah. Yeah, you know that is me. It's like. I feel personally victimized. That is me. But I would say outside of those type of scenarios, for the most part I would say that I I choose music. I feel like music ever since I was a young girl has helped me when I'm feeling anxious, overwhelmed.

41:45 I mean, I have distinct memory of my mom. Like she, she would pick up on if I was feeling just, yeah, kind of overwhelmed, stressed, something like that. She would actually encourage me to go and she would say you need to go listen to your music. Yeah. Like she would say you that's really funny. She would say you need to go find your go get your, like, Walkman CD player and your headphones, and you should go listen to The Beatles or go listen, you know, go listen to your music. And man, it would just have a calming effect on me and that it's still to this day, like, I can be feeling stressed or overwhelmed.

42:30 And maybe I go and do a workout on. I'll. I'll run while listening to music. And yeah, it's pretty. It's great. So I would say I typically choose music. And part of the downside to that, though, a confession is like I struggle with just allowing for silence though at times, you know, like the discipline of silence and solitude is definitely something I would like to grow in because I probably, like many, find myself often filling silent spaces with background noise or music or whatever. And I want to be able to appreciate just silence and, and grow and being more comfortable with that.

43:16 Yeah, yeah. It's a quitting answer #2 OK, so Stranger Things has a lot of needle drops, true. What song do you think is the first song people think of when they think of Stranger Things? Other than the theme song, obviously. Yeah, we'll say OK, because that would be too easy of an answer. OK, well, I don't know if I can speak on behalf of the entire fandom, but I mean, for me personally, it's got to be Running up that Hill, A Deal With God by Kate Bush. I mean, I know there are so many amazing songs and Stranger Things and we enjoy doing deep dives on them, but that song just has arguably the most iconic scene in the entire show.

44:06 And it felt like the climax of the show in a lot of ways. The climax of the show, you know what I'm saying? So I think running up that hill. I mean, does any other song save a character in the show? Yeah, it's got to be that song. And I mean like when you show me different Instagram reels or yeah, like things about Stranger. Things that's usually the one that people choose to put in the. Background. That's usually the background song, yeah. Or like when I'm just like at a coffee shop or wherever and I hear that song come on just immediately first I feel like calm at peace.

44:41 But too I, I mean, immediately I'm thinking of Stranger Things. Yeah. So. Yeah, number three, OK. What is a worship song that you've continually gone back to in order to connect with God? Oh yeah, that's a good question. There are several, but if I had to maybe pick a favorite or the one that maybe I've gone back to the most, I would say, OK, it's the group is I promise it is a worship team, but they're called Rivers and Robots. So I also just automatically and just like, yeah, I love that name.

45:19 That's really cool. But the song is called Forevermore. And yeah, it's just very sweet. And it's just very calmly and sweetly with a beautiful melody, walks you through the gospel message. And I think I, I feel a lot of connection to that. I, I think that, yeah, if there are times where I'm feeling like shame from my own sin or yeah, anxiety or whatever it is, I, I will find myself putting that song on. It's not super upbeat and so it kind of has a calming effect, but it just, it just reminds me of the truth of who God is and what Christ did for me.

46:01 If you guys haven't heard it, I highly recommend it's. It's really beautifully written. So Forevermore by Rivers and Robots, yeah. All right, we go to #4 Is there a worship song that's gotten you through a hard season? Oh definitely. I'm going to have to say two of them though. I can't, I can't just pick one. So the two that come to mind for me, one is called Oh, love that will not let me go by ascend the hill. That one for sure. Have cried a lot. Just yeah, singing that song, whether it's battling.

46:47 I mean, often it was like when I was in a really, really long season of just waiting, waiting on the Lord, particularly for a spouse, you know, if he was going to provide that. But yeah. Or just like feeling lonely relationally. Like in times where I'd been betrayed by friends or left out or something. Like, I just, yeah, I have clear memory of singing that song and weeping with the Lord and taking comfort in knowing that Jesus wept as well. Yeah. But his love doesn't let us go. And then the other one is a group that I really, really like.

47:27 They're from Knoxville, TN They're called United Pursuit. And check out all of their stuff. But in particular, the one I'm thinking of, there's a song called Seasons Change. And the premise of the song is like, yeah, seasons are going to change throughout your life. There's going to be high highs and low lows, but God does not change. His character does not change. His love for you does not change, even though the seasons go up and down and things change or people come in and out of your life like God is always there.

48:04 And so, yeah, I've taken a lot of comfort in that and I have had lots of good shower, cry, sing that song. So, yeah, yeah. Yeah #5. OK. Lyrics or melody which hits you harder?

48:22 That's really hard. I, I have so much appreciation and respect for, I don't know both for the art of both of them, but I guess because I am a poet by nature, like I love writing poetry, which essentially could be lyrics, like I've written lyrics before. And so I think that more often than not, I probably, as much as I love music and I love the instrumentalization of it all and the genius of it, I think that I connect deeper and more quickly with lyrics. Like, I'll go, I enjoy songs for the music, but the songs that I find myself going back to over and over and over have really deep or meaningful lyrics.

49:11 Yeah. Yeah, yeah, that's good. Number six. OK, Do you have a song that instantly takes you back to your childhood? Oh yeah. Oh man, I can again. I cannot just pick one. I'm so sorry. I'm gonna have to list three. I'm gonna list 3. Is that OK? OK, so number one, number one, number one. The first one admittedly that came to mind for me was run Rudolph, run by Chuck Berry. Like the Christmas song, you know, I just have vivid memory of like dancing. You know, we had a big boom box, which is like a for people that maybe don't know, it's like ACD player, you know, radio in our kitchen.

49:58 And we had ACD where we put that song on and at Christmas time, I just love Christmas time. It feels very nostalgic for me. And I would put that song on and I just remember like dancing around in my socks in the kitchen singing, you know, singing my little heart out. Run, Rudolph, run. I also think about from the Annie, the 1982 movie, Annie, the soundtrack. My younger sister Lindsay and I would play dress up and watch that movie and, you know, and sing along to the songs. And the one that was my favorite is called You're Never Fully Dressed Without a Smile.

50:36 And so yeah, I actually showed Joel that movie recently and it was just very sweet for me because I'm like, I feel like I'm showing you a big part of my childhood because I my mom loves that movie. So we watched it a lot. And I actually have it on vinyl, which is really fun, the soundtrack. And then the other one, it's funny. The reason why I laughed earlier because you brought up another one that I was thinking about when you said Enya. I the third one is, yeah, is, is an Enya song. And I would yeah, like take long bass, bubble bass.

51:15 You know, as a kid, my mom, I just remember her putting her Enya CD on in the CD player and just whatever. And so whenever. Oh, so I just, yeah, I associate, I mean, my childhood with that music, which was pretty calming. Yeah, Yeah. So yeah, yeah. I think what was it called? Only time was. Only time. Oh yeah. That's the song in particular that was like my most listened to of. Of Enya. So yeah, OK, we've got a few more. OK #7 Which character in Stranger Things has the best music taste?

51:55 So I, I feel like people would maybe people would be prone to want to say Jonathan right away because they'll think about season 1 when he is introducing Will to like the Clash. And then he also throws out he named drops like Joy Division and David Bowie. And so he does have great taste, like I'll give him that. But I think I'm going to go against the grain and say Robin Buckley. I think Robin has amazing taste and like, well, that's what I'm thinking. Like her taste. I mean, honestly, her taste in just the arts because she has such good taste in film that she got the job at the video store specifically because she would be able to give movie suggestions.

52:44 And then she then also works with Steve later on in Season 5. Or well, yeah, early on in the the season, we know that she is a disc jockey at WSQK. The Squawk for her music taste. And I also think about that scene in Season 4 when Nancy is temporarily under Vecna's curse and Vecna's like, revealing to her his plan of what he's trying to do. And so then Robin, Steve and Eddie were like rapidly trying to find music, like find a song that they could play to try to snap Nancy out of that trance or trancy, I don't know.

53:32 And and, and Robin, what is it that she said she's like, I don't know, Bowie, Blondie, Madonna, anything. We need music, you know? So she yeah, she she has good taste. And she knew what all the different songs that each of her friends would need, like if she needed to quickly throw that on the radio to be able to save them. If, if for some reason they encountered Rekna, like she, she had memorized what their favorite songs are. So I think I'd pick Robin. Nice. Yeah, solid choice. Is that is that who you were thinking or?

54:08 I mean at 1st, at first I was thinking like maybe Max because I mean running up that hill is like. Max Max does have. It's like, OK Max has good taste but I forgot. Duh, Robin. Robin has a more she has more variety in her taste and I appreciate that. Yeah, yeah, I think, yeah. I mean, we know more about Robin's taste, too, whereas with Max, I don't think we know as much about, like, what artist she likes. I think, yeah. Yeah, and I think in Season 5, Robin even at one point is wearing AT shirt for a band.

54:47 I can't remember which band, it might have been The Who or The Ramones or something. But I'm like, yeah, she she loves music. So I think I got to give it to Robin. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Well, we get to the final question and I'm going off script here. OK. Is final question the different music artists that are in Stranger Things? If you were playing a card game, which music artist would be the Jack, Queen, King and Ace?

55:22 I'm sorry, I don't think I understand the question. So like, think of the different music artists and Stranger Things. You get a, you get a deck of Stranger Things music artists and you're dealing out cards like who would be ace? So like the top one, like more power? Yeah, I think of ACE as high. OK. In this case. Well, I mean, I guess that'd have to be Kate Bush. I was thinking that, but yeah. So the ace is Kate Bush. OK, King. The king of all of Stranger Things. Like if any any season artist being mentioned, it's like fair game.

56:02 Yeah, Oh my goodness, that's Wow. Mentioned or played? We'll do played, played. Yeah, maybe reduce. OK, OK, Reduce the pull a little bit. Man, maybe, maybe Prince. I think Prince would be the king. Yeah, Which is kind of a funny thing. It's kind of funny. Yeah. That Prince would be the. King Prince would be the king. Yeah, I think so. Queen. The Queen. Oh, we don't have Queen in this show though. Oh, I know. The band Queen, Yeah. I wondered if they were going to play any of Yeah I. Did not. I was.

56:39 Yeah, surprised. OK who would be after? So we have Kate Bush and then Prince third. Who would be third? Oh, my goodness. That's so tough. I want to say maybe David Bowie. Yeah, I think I'm gonna go with David Bowie. OK, yeah. And then Jack. Jack OK. Like who are the four face cards of the deck? So Kate Bush? Prince. David Bowie. Yeah. Oh man, OK. I feel like 4-4 Stranger Things. I I think it would have to be the Clash. I'm not necessarily saying that I would put rank them that high, like I enjoy their music, but I, I do think that like the Clash is very important and Stranger Things in the plot.

57:43 And so I think, yeah, I would be remiss of us not to at least mention them. So I think maybe the Clash. Gotcha. Yeah. Nice. Yeah. That's a fun question. Thanks for entertaining my spontaneous question. Yeah, and with that, that about wraps it up. Thank you all so much for listening. If you enjoyed listening, please give us a review or rating on Spotify, Apple, Audible, Amazon, the Internet, just wherever you find us as that helps us reach more listeners like you. Totally. Our next episode will be focusing entirely on the new spinoff series Stranger Things, Tales from 85.

58:28 So if you have any quick reactions to the animated series, we would love to hear from you. You can contact us at [email protected] or on Instagram at our handle Camp Nowhere pod. Thank you all so much again. And we'll catch you on the next one. See y'all bye.

59:13 Music.