"Should I Stay or Should I Go" by The Clash - The Music of Stranger Things

0:20 Hey y'all, and welcome back to Camp Nowhere, a Stranger Things podcast. My name is Lauren. And my name's Joel. We're so thankful you were here to listen to US process all things Stranger Things. We are doing another miniseries called The Music of Stranger Things, where we'll take a deep dive into some key songs that are featured in the show. For this episode, we're focusing on the song Should I Stay or should I Go by The Clash? Yes, and when we say deep dive, we mean a thorough song analysis, sharing lots of research we've done about the song itself, why it was written, as well as looking into the specific moments the song is used throughout the TV series.

1:00 Exactly why was it chosen for those specific moments? What kind of emotional implications does it have and resonating with the audience, and how does it affect or advance the overall plot of the show? With these things in mind, spoiler alert, if you haven't yet watched Stranger Things in its entirety, seasons one through 5, be warned. We will be discussing spoilers. We will. OK, now that you've been warned, go watch Stranger Things and then listen to Should I Stay or Should I Go? So for the first segment here, we'll discuss who wrote the song, when they wrote it, and what was the historical and personal context of it.

1:40 Lauren, hit us up what you discovered in your research. Absolutely. So Should I Stay or Should I Go? Was written by Mick Jones of the British punk rock band The Clash, with the song credited to the band as a whole. It was written in 1981 and then released in 1982 on their album entitled Combat Rock. The band score lineup was Mick Jones on lead guitar, vocals and sometimes keyboard. Joe Strummer was the lead vocalist with rhythm guitar and sometimes keyboard and piano. Paul Simonon was their bass guitarist and would occasionally contribute to vocals.

2:20 Topper Heaton was their percussionist and sometimes contributed vocals and other instruments on rare occasions as well. Joe Ely was the backup vocalist for this particular song, though Mick Jones sang the lead vocals. The most likely personal context is Jones's turbulent romantic and professional relationship with Ellen Foley, which several later accounts say helped inspire the lyrics, though Jones later downplayed the idea of it being strictly autobiographical. Ellen Foley is an American singer and actress who helped collaborate as a backup singer for The Clash.

3:01 Foley herself has said she isn't sure the song was strictly about her, though she acknowledges it's a strong possibility and doesn't necessarily mind the association. In short, she was both Jones's girlfriend and a collaborator, which likely made the emotional fallout feel kind of, you know, inseparable from the music, Jones said on Broadway box set liner 1991. It wasn't about anybody specific, and it wasn't pre empting my leaving the Clash. It was just a good rockin song, our attempt at writing a classic.

3:36 When we were just playing, that was the kind of thing we used to like to play. Historically, the song came out during a tense period for the band as they were under pressure creatively and commercially while making their album Combat Rock. Here's a clip from Music Mongoose on how the song was what led to the ultimate end of the band. For many, though, this song signalled the end for The Clash. As mentioned, Mick Jones was focusing now on creating classics, or in other words, chant friendly songs.

4:09 But Strummer was much more driven by his political beliefs, and he was adamant that The Clash should be used to amplify the voices of the oppressed and raise awareness about injustice. And this growing divide between their priorities is evident in Should I Stay or Should I Go? The track was crafted with radio play in mind and it succeeded, becoming one of the least political songs on Combat Rock. Instead of delivering a political message, it found its groove on indie rock dance floors. And just a year later, after the album's release and following a disastrous set at AUS Festival, the band was heading for an inevitable split.

4:47 A year after its release, Mick Jones was sacked from the band. 3 new members were added in. What followed was a few years of Fighting and a very disappointing album in Cut the Crap. By 1986 the band and had officially called Time. However, in 1991, Should I Stay or Should I Go? Was used in a popular commercial for Levi's jeans in the UK and after it was re released it became the band's first and only #1 single in the UK, albeit nearly a full decade after it's original release and seven years after Jones had left the band.

5:20 In the US, Should I Stay or Should I Go did chart on the Billboard Hot 100, peaking at #45 in late 1982 and staying on into early 1983. It was not a Top 40 hit at the time, but it was the clashes highest charting Hot 100 single in the USI also found that the songs feature and Stranger Things increased its long term Spotify presence substantially, and one later analysis noted that by the time it was compared against their entire catalog or discography, Should I Stay or Should I Go had become by far their most streamed track with nearly 1.5 billion streams to date.

6:01 Yeah, that's wild. Now that we've covered some of that context, let's talk about the song's connection to Stranger Things. So what particular seasons, episodes, scenes where the song plays? Why we think they chose to play the song at those times too. 1st we got to establish how this song even got to be chosen for the show in the 1st place. So in an early January 2026 interview. So actually like. Pretty. Recently, Yeah, With NPR. Nora Felder, who is the show's music supervisor, said this when asked how she chose this song.

6:41 Well, actually, the Duffers chose this one. A lot of people assume that I'm out there picking all the songs and presenting it to them. And you know, yes, there are those cases, but in this case, they knew that they wanted the song with what they were painting. With the initial bond that was happening between Jonathan and Will, kind of passing it down to Will, I thought it was an excellent choice. So here's a brief clip of the Duffers talking about how certain songs, especially this one from The Clash, play such a key role in the show's narrative.

7:14 No, we, we, we knew, you know, a lot of those Neil drafts were written to the scripts. Like obviously we knew, you know, the Clash was going to play an important part of the narrative. Joy Division was written to the show. So a lot of that was, was was was written into the narrative. And I think that's something that we try to do with it. We don't, we don't want to just put in a song for fun. We want it to, sometimes we do, but mostly we try to make sure that it's it's either story driven or character driven.

7:46 And I think those songs that have been most successful have fallen into that category. And kids. Songs sometimes like help with. Leading something? Whether it's, I don't know, kind of get into the core of a character. Sometimes or internalization or. Something and at times. Exactly, Yeah. And obviously sort of something that we, I mean, we started playing with really, I mean, on season 1, really with with Will singing the song to sort of comfort himself in the upside down. We carried that forward into season 2 when they used the song in order to reach reach into actually and and talk to Will when he was possessed in a way by the mind flare.

8:27 And then all that sort of culminated to to the idea of Max and and the and the Kate Bush running up that hill scene. So I think for us, when it's most effective, it's when it's doing both the things that Matt was talking about, where it is, it is telling you something about this character and it's tied into into the narrative as opposed to just going, you know, like sometimes we do, we'll have a scene and we'll like this, you know, a song can make this better and we'll just listen to 30 different songs over and see what's the right vibe.

9:02 But generally that's not how we do it. Generally it's it's thinking about the character and the and the script and the narrative and, and trying to find the the perfect song for that moment. So they alluded to a few of the scenes where the song is used, but we can expand on those. Lauren, want to share the first one? Totally. So the song first place in season 1 episode 2 entitled The Weirdo on Maple St. Jonathan is driving to his dad's house in Indianapolis to see if Will is there or if his dad knows anything about his whereabouts.

9:38 And then this song comes on the radio. The scene then shifts to a flashback of the first time Jonathan showed the song to Will on his record player. Their joyful moment of bonding is shadowed by the sound of their mom, Joyce yelling at their dad, Lonnie on the phone for not coming to take Will to a baseball game. So here's here's a clip of that scene and the next. Is black. It's not coming, is he?

10:06 Don't you even like baseball? No, but I don't know. It's fun to go with him sometimes. Come on, has he ever done anything with you that you actually like? You know, like the arcade or something. I don't know, no. All right, He hasn't. He's trying to force you to like normal things, and you shouldn't like things because people tell you you're supposed to. OK, especially not him.

10:32 Be like the Clash for real. For real. Definitely. Jonathan has a great point. What is normal anyway? You know? The second time the song plays is actually later on in that same episode. Joyce, who is home alone, sees lights flickering in the hallway leading up to Will's bedroom. So she walks in that direction and is startled because should I stay or should I go? Starts loudly playing on its own through the cassette player in Will's bedroom with lights flickering on and off. She grabs the flickering lamp and says Will.

11:08 So this is the first time she is associating the lights with Will and she believes he's trying to communicate with her somehow. As soon as she said his name, the lamp got super bright and then burnt out right as the song cut off. She then sees something trying to come through the walls so she screams naturally and you know wouldn't you and runs out to her car. But before she drives away the lights come back on as does the song and so she says his name again. Will turns off the car and bravely enters back into a house that honestly probably high key seem haunted.

11:49 So bless her. The third time the song is utilized is in Season 1 episode 4 called The Body, when Elle and Mike are in Mike's basement after they found out Will's body had been recovered from the quarry. Supposedly, Mike is flipping through papers and Elle is manipulating the walkie-talkie in an attempt to transmit Will's voice from the Upside Down. She channels him and then he hears him softly singing. Should I stay or should I go? Here's a brief snippet of that scene.

12:27 Can you please stop that? Are you deaf? I thought we were friends. You know, we're friends. Tell each other the truth. And they definitely don't lie to each other. You made me think Will was OK, that he was still out there. But he wasn't. He wasn't. Maybe you thought you were helping, but you weren't. You hurt me. Do you understand what you did sucks?

12:59 Lucas is right about you all along.

13:12 Come on, let me know. Should I stay or should I go?

13:19 Should I go? Should I do? Should I go now if I? Go. There will be trouble. If.

13:31 There. Will be trouble. Will, is that you? It's Mike. Did you copy over? Will, are you there? Will was. That was it.

13:58 The song plays again later on in that same episode when Joyce plays it on the cassette player in the living room. She shouts, come on, talk to me, I know you're here. She's clearly trying to connect with Will. She then pauses the song and because she hears banging on the wall and Will's voice saying Mom. Yeah, the song is used again season 1 episode 7 called The Bathtub after Elle went into the void and it found Will hiding out in castle Buyers. He's cold and scared, and he tells them to hurry. After Elle left the void, we see Will yet again weekly singing the lyrics to Should I Stay or Should I Go?

14:38 As a way to kind of try to comfort himself. He abruptly stopped singing when he hears the demagogue in nearby. And this scene is huge because it'll actually come back in a significant way in Season 5, so stay tuned. For show. But before we go there, the song is used again in season 10. But wait, there's more. In season 2 episode 8 called The Mind Flayer, after Hopper realizes Will, who was possessed and being used as a spy by the Mind Flayer, was communicating with the gang through Morse code. So they decide to use the song and talk about other memories in order to stay connected to Will install time so Will can use the Morse code to instruct them on what they need to do to fix things, which would be to close the gate.

15:28 Here's a brief clip from that scene. Do you remember the first time I played you this? Mom and dad were both arguing in the next room, so I played you the mix tape I made you, and it was the first time you got into music, real music.

15:48 OK, got. It see.

15:51 The montage is so epic and honestly a brilliant tactic by Will to help them out. Totally. So the last time I think I'm pretty sure that the song is used in the show is in the opening scene of Season 5, episode 1 called The Crawl. It's a flashback to Season 1 when Will is lost in the Upside Down. He's lonely, cold, and singing that familiar tune we'd all come to know throughout the show. So here's a short clip of that moment. Stay should I go down and.

16:33 If I'm going home, I'll be trouble. And if I stay, there won't be trouble. So come on and let me know. Should I stay or should I go?

16:52 And then it's cool how from there we see how that ties into Season 5 because then, you know, it's revealed that, oh, a Demogorgon took Will and brought Will to the Mind Flayer. I mean, to Vecna. Yeah. And then that's where Vecna implanted whatever. Weird. And we never find out what that is so. Yeah, Vekna attached some weird gooey upside down fire hose thing to him and injected him with something, and that caused the connection that was so important for seasons 1:00 and 2:00 and 3:00 and 4:00. And then, you know, in Season 5, he just lives after Vecna dies.

17:44 But that's OK. That's whatever. That's fine. OK Switching gears, Lauren, what was it like hearing should I stay or should I go for the first time in Stranger Things? And why do you think this song resonates with the audience? Yeah, I mean, I was pumped because I definitely grew up hearing that song on different oldies like radio stations. I've always enjoyed the sound of British rock bands in particular, so yeah, I was pumped. I was stoked. I think it resonates with the audience because it works on several levels at once.

18:19 I think emotional, psychological, like a nostalgic level, like emotionally. The song is literally about a painful in between moment, the need to stay or go, with both choices feeling heavy and risky. That mirrors the show's constant tension. Will is trapped between 2 worlds, Joyce deciding whether to flee her house or stay and fight this monster thing, and the kids stuck in life or death limbo. And fans feel that echo. And every time the song comes up in the show and then in in the plot, the song becomes a thread tying the buyer's family together.

19:04 It's a favorite of Jonathan and Will's. It's later used as a coping or messaging device when Will is in the Upside Down, making it a symbol of their connection and survival. Because it physically appears in key scenes, like in Will's room, the car, radio, Will's like singing in the lyrics. It feels like part of the show's world, not just some kind of background track. Yeah, that's so good for me, my reaction when I first heard the song, I was familiar with the song because I had heard it before, though I honestly don't know from where.

19:43 But the first thing that comes to mind when I hear the song now is the scene we talked about earlier, where Joyce hears the song booming through the stereo in Will's room. And then the song and the lights go out and she sees something stretching through the wall. And so she just bolts out of the house. I mean, wouldn't you? Well, yeah. And that was such, yeah, that was a really cool moment. And that's. Yeah, that's the scene I think of when I hear the song now. Yeah, I rewatched that scene today, actually.

20:17 And the silence that follows after the song cuts out is just terrifying. Like, should I stay or should I go? And. Surely they did that intentionally. Oh, they did. Yeah. Well, it's it's so well done. And it's a funny. It's a funny touch, too, because the song cuts out in the show right after he says. Or should I go? And it's almost as if Joyce learned that the answer in that situation was to go. I gotta go. I gotta go. Yeah, for sure. OK, Well I think we can move into a deep dive into the actual like instrumentalization and lyrics analysis of the song itself.

21:08 Fo SHO, so let's dig in. OK. So yeah, compared to the other songs that we've done, this is definitely a simpler song. It has that driving riff. The chords structure is pretty simple and repetitive. I was looking at some chord charts online just to make sure and yeah, basically from the verses and the chorus, like it basically stays the same, yeah, as far as the order of the chords goes. And so it's. Almost like a rock ballad. Yeah, right. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, it's got some rock elements and so some things that stick out to me.

21:58 One is what's called the lowered 7th scale degree. So what I mean is like, you can hear it like, you know, the song goes and then the lower 7th scale degree is and that just fits so much more than keeping like without lowering the 7th scale degree because if they didn't lower it then it would sound like and that just doesn't. That almost sounds kind of like flat. It just sounds weird, Yeah. It doesn't fit the vibe. Yeah. And yeah. And just, I think it makes it sound more fun too, by lowering that.

23:00 And then of course, like in that scene that I mentioned with Joyce, the part that the Duffer's intentionally chose to play during that scene was the double time part of it. So like for the verses, it's boom, cha, boom, cha boom. Should I stay or should I go Cha boom? But. And of course, it's boom, cha, boom, cha boom, cha boom, cha boom. Should I stay or should I go Like it? Yeah, Yeah. It double s the time and that creates more intensity and which is perfect for that scene. If I go it will be double.

23:44 It will be double time, Yeah, look at that. Yeah. And then I just love the scream at the beginning. The yeah, it's, it's iconic. It just helps establish that this is a fun and lively song. And I just don't think the song would be the same without that in the intro. And then of course, something that definitely sets it apart too is that it has not only a call and response kind of feel to it, but the call and and response when you listen closely isn't Spanish. And it's so cool. I love that. Yeah. And so here's a clip about that.

24:30 Now, one of the most striking things about this song are how the lyrics are echoed in Spanish. Strummer came up with this idea, and he enlisted the help of his friend and country rocker Joe Eli to help him with the translation. Eli later said. I'm singing all the Spanish verses on that and I even helped translate them. I translated them into Tex Mex. And Strummer kind of knew Castilian Spanish because he grew up in Spain in his early life. And a Puerto Rican engineer, Eddie Garcia, kind of added a little flavour to it.

25:05 So it's taking the verse and then repeating it in Spanish. I absolutely love that there is a Spanish section. AMI me with a mucho For those of you guys who don't know, I enjoy speaking Spanish sometimes, you know, occasionally. OK, so now for a lyrical analysis. Lyrically, the song is about uncertainty in a relationship. Staying means emotional pain, leaving means conflict, and neither option feels necessarily safe. The repeated question, should I stay or should I go? Captures indecision, frustration, and a need for the other person to finally be honest.

25:49 Lines like if I go there will be trouble and if I stay it will be double. Make the relationship sound like a no win situation where the speaker feels trapped between two bad outcomes. The song's language also suggests power imbalance, emotional manipulation, and a loss of identity, especially in the verses about TS TS TS and exactly whom I'm supposed to be. So why it works is part of the song's power is that music and lyrics match each other perfectly. The riff is urgent, the vocal exchanges feel argumentative, and the structure itself sounds like a back and forth debate that makes the song feel playful and emotionally fraught, which is a big reason it stayed memorable well beyond its original punk era context.

26:43 Alrighty, I think it's time we move on to a Lightning. Round. So I'm going to ask you a series of questions to get your honest reactions and opinions. For context, Joel has not seen these questions, so you're getting his raw thoughts. All right, here we go #1. Number one. If you could dub this song over any other scene in the show where it doesn't currently play. Which scene would you pick? And this could replace a song that's already being used in that scene. OK, where can, where could the song be used in the show?

27:23 I mean, honestly, what immediately comes to mind is that as much as I love Fernando, I think that it could work in Season 5. OK. The the episode, I think is it 2, It's either two or three. The Vanishing of Holly Wheeler, where the Demogorgon appears. The Demogorgon attacks the Wheeler house. Yeah, that's what immediately comes to mind is that that song could play there. I mean, I still think Fernando works better, but. But that's what comes to mind at first. Part of me does wonder, though, like maybe a scene with Eddie in it, because like Eddie, yeah, like he definitely likes more metal music, but I'm sure he would like the Clash, too.

28:13 Yeah, I would think. Yeah, that would be in his music musical taste as well. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Well, and Eddie also kind of wrestles with the whole like, temptation to just flee, like in fear a lot like that's one of his character things is like wanting to overcome that and to like actually choose to stay and do the courageous thing. So yeah, I mean, should I say or should I go? Could totally work for Eddie. Yeah, that's, yeah, that's a really good, a good choice. All right #2. #2. When have you felt like you were in a should I stay or should I go moment in your life?

28:56 Oh goodness. So it's a little more personal for you. Yeah, I mean, I guess two things come to mind would be after I graduated high school and after I graduated college, because after I graduated high school, well, I guess it was before then. But anyway, my senior year I there was a a ministry team that traveled by and I had never heard of them. And I was wondering if maybe instead of going to college immediately after high school, if I would go to like join the ministry team instead. And so the should I stay part could be going to college because I eventually just went to college near where I lived.

29:52 And yeah. And then the should I go part could be if I should join the ministry team that traveled around the US. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, I'm glad you got to have that experience. Yeah, me too. All right #3. #3. If this song had a color, what would it be and why? I mean, OK, so so I don't know what episode it was, but I think Lauren mentioned that I have synesthesia. Probably our music and memory one. Yes, yes, it was that one. So yeah, she mentioned that I have synesthesia. So certain songs create different colours really because of the pitch or like the the key that it's in.

30:39 So yeah, should I stay or should I go is in the key of D? And so yeah, I I think of like a lighter green with that. That's what comes to mind with D songs in D So so I know that's kind of a weird answer, but just with synesthesia, I would say D. OK. Is it like a like a neon green or what kind of green or talking? Probably, probably the leaves like behind you we're we're near a window. Yeah. The like a leaf kind of like the leaf green like of those. Yeah, yeah. Those plants back there, I would say probably a lighter green.

31:28 Love that. Yeah, I love that. Just so you guys know, green is probably like our favorite color. Yeah, all right #4. #4. If you had to choose a different song for Will's character theme or like his comfort song, which one would you choose and why?

31:48 And I'm trying to think too, because it would have to be during, it would probably be during his lifetime, right? I guess it could, I guess it could be a song that came out before he was born, but it would more likely be something that came out during his life, I'm sure without being able to do any research on it in the moment to see like what's available in the 80s. I mean you could do a quick scroll through my 80s best playlist on Spotify if you want that's. True. I mean, I don't know what What could come to mind is come on, Eileen.

32:24 I don't know if that. Dexy's midnight runners. Come on, Eileen. But I don't know if that's, would that have been out at the time? Yeah. You can, I mean you can look it up real quick if you want. I'm curious. I know it is an 80s song. I am struggling to remember the exact year it came out.

32:45 Come on, Eileen, it came out in 82. OK, so that could totally work. So that could be, yeah. So why? Come on. Come on, Eileen. I think because the the rhythm of the I think the rhythm of the chorus kind of matches the rhythm of the hook. And should I stay or should I go? Like, should I stay or should I go burner? Like should I stay or should I go now? Like that kind of sounds like come on, Eileen. Yeah. And so maybe that it's also a happier song. And should I stay or should I go even though it's.

33:33 Yeah, like about a conflict. It's a cheery sounding song. Yeah. Like it. It's a song that you want to, like, clap or dance to. I mean, there's even shouting at the beginning of it. So yeah, come on, Eileen is just a fun song. Like you're, you're happy when you listen to it and sing along. Yeah. So I could like, I could imagine him like, you know, in the, in the, like in castle buyers, like singing. Come on, Eileen. Like, yeah. Yeah, interesting. I thought you were gonna maybe mention that because that is a song I very much associate with the book and movie The Perks of Being a Wallflower.

34:16 Oh, it's in that. Movie, Yeah. And it like, plays in a pivotal scene where the main character is like, he's at the school dance and he's kind of being a wallflower, just kind of staying to himself. But then eventually comes out of a shell and actually joins in on the fun and dances with everyone. Because you mentioned it's an upbeat song, but like, I just thought, OK, wallflower. The stereotype is it tends to be someone who's sort of more quiet, reserved, maybe considered an outsider. And so Will, I don't know, I just thought about, yeah, Will might identify with that.

34:50 Well, yeah, I mean, he definitely would, especially in season 3 is a season 3 where. Yeah, I think that's the season, yeah, where Will wants to play D&D, but Mike and Lucas in particular are just not really. They're more. Like preoccupied with yeah, Accident 11, Yeah. Yeah, they don't really care. Yeah. Like they're. Yeah, they're in their romantic relationships and Will just feels kind of left out. So kind of like a wallflower, Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So that totally works. A will flower. A will flower.

35:25 Oh my goodness. Wow, wow, wow, That just. And a demogorgon kind of looks like a creepy flower. It does. And a Demogorgon took will look at him full circle. All the connections. Oh my goodness. Wow, he's never bored. I'm never bored. OK, OK. I don't even know which one we're on #5. #5. Is The Clash or Kate Bush the better Stranger Things music moment in your opinion?

36:00 OK, music moment. Do you mean like a particular scene where each of them played? Cause yeah, 'cause like when I heard that question for running up that hill like Kate Bush, I I thought of the deer Billy. That's exactly what I mean. Like I was thinking. Duh. But. Right. But then with the should I stay or? Should I go? It is. Used a lot in the show. I guess I was thinking more so the moment where Joyce kind of has to either choose. To. Flee. Or is she gonna go and try to fight the monster 'cause she's like hearing that song play loudly in Will's room?

36:39 And yeah. They're both such great moments.

36:50 I think, OK, maybe a hot take. I think I may actually go with the Clash on this one. That is definitely a hot take. I know it is. I was not expecting Oh my goodness, and I do disagree, but I'm curious to hear your reasoning. I knew you would disagree, but that's. OK. Yeah, because you all need to know that. In case you didn't know, Spotify just came out with this feature where you can like, like find out what are all the top songs that you've listened to the most ever since you first ever downloaded Spotify.

37:28 And for my number one song. Y'all get one guess? My number one song that I've listened to more than any other song on Spotify in the last more than 10 years has been Running Up That Hill by Kate Bush. There you go. So I feel like it would be wrong for me to pick the Clash in that moment. But yeah, why? Why do you say the Clash? I think so for a couple of reasons. I I love Season 1. Season 1's super special. And supernatural. And supernatural. But I do remember, like, I do remember being floored, like I was really surprised when Joyce actually went back into the house because the direction I thought when I first watched it was I thought Joyce is going to run into the car and she's going to try to find Hopper.

38:21 Which would make sense. Like I, I thought that's what she was going to do. Because he's kind of the protector of her family in the town and right. Yeah, like she's going to go find Hopper, and then she just grits her teeth and it's like, no, I'm going back in there. She she would be the most likely to go feral. For her. Children, she did win that superlative. She did. In our opinion. Check out the last episode. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So that moment was special. And it was cool because, you know, like we talked about before, Joyce fighting the tension between should I stay or should I go?

39:00 And she chose to stay.

39:03 I think the other reason I would say is that the durability moment where Max escapes from Vecna's whatever mindscape thing is that's. The full name of it the the whatever mindscape thing. Yeah, that's what the Duffers called it. Yeah. Off screen. Off screen, I was about to say. That well, I beat you to it you. Did. Oh my goodness. So although that is a great moment, we do have to keep in mind that it wasn't like a arrangement of the song. So in that, so in that moment, so like we have to establish that we're not quite comparing apples to apples because.

39:46 That was like an orchestral. It's like an orchestral version. Of the song. And like, yeah, like what you're hearing when Max is running is so cool and so epic, but it's not the original song. It is like an instrumental. That's fair. Epic orchestration. And I'm like, OK, I do have to keep that in mind. But yeah, I think I may go with the The Clash on that one. Wow. OK, yeah, our opinions do clash. And you know what? That's. OK, that's OK. We're still very happily married. Healthy disagreement. Wow number.

40:23 6. We learn in Season 5 that Nancy Wheeler hates the Clash. Why do you think that is? Do you think she actually hates their music, or does it have to do more with her Rocky, pun intended, rocky relationship with Jonathan?

40:44 It's like during their breakup scene. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, they're what? What do they call it like? A. Was it like an UN proposal? An UN proposal or something? Yeah. OK. I guess something that would be helpful to know is does Nancy talk about songs that she does like? Like do we know anything about her taste? Cuz it could just be that she genuinely has, well, she likes different music. Well, Robin is friends with her and in season 4, in the moment when Vecna has Nancy in a trance, A trancy I think is what we called that was drinking in water, right?

41:27 So, OK, focus. So in that moment, of course, they're like frantically trying to find music 'cause they think that she needs like a lifeline, fact, reality. And that's when Robin's like Bowie, Bowie, Blondie, Beatles music, we need music. And so maybe she, I don't, that doesn't guarantee, but it's likely she at least has some idea of Nancy's taste. Or maybe that was just her taste that she thought Nancy would like. So I don't know for sure but. I mean, I know it's kind of a cop out answer, but I'm, I think it might be a mix of both.

42:08 She it may not be at least. Yeah, the genre that the Clash does may not be what she likes, but I think there may also be some sourness to it because, I mean, how can she not think of Jonathan? Yeah, anytime that The Clash is mentioned or plays a song, you know. Yeah, or just like all of the pain and anxiety that was induced from everything that happened to Will, like she cares about Will, especially because of her relationship with the buyer's family. And you can't you. Yeah, You can't not think about the buyer's boys when you hear the clash or it's mentioned.

42:54 So you're right. I mean, that's probably why she just kind of would rather not because it's associated with some not great memories. Yeah, for sure. OK #7 #7 Did the show improve the song or did the song improve the show? With all due respect to the Clash, I think the show might have improved the song. OK, why? Do you think that, well, I mean, from one of the things you said earlier where the, the clashes Spotify presence like especially that song skyrocketed after the show came out? And it definitely started being played on the radio much more frequently.

43:39 Yeah. Yeah. Because of its use in the show. Yeah. And it's. Yeah. And it's such a cool use of the song as well, just because it captures different tensions between different characters and situations. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I'll be honest, if I'm just ever out and about and that song comes on immediately, I'm thinking of Stranger Things. Like that is that is the only thing I associate with that song would be Stranger Things. And so I think I would agree with you on that. Yeah. All right. Well, that concludes the lightning round.

44:15 Well there you go. Thank you all so much for listening and if you enjoyed listening, please give us a review or rating wherever you are listening to this podcast as this helps us reach other listeners like you. Totally. So our next episode will be another music deep dive in this miniseries and the focus will be on the song Material Girl by Madonna. If you have any thoughts about the song or how it was used in Stranger Things, we'd love to hear from you. You can contact us at [email protected] or on Instagram at our handle Camp Nowhere Pod.

44:51 Thank you all so much again. And we'll catch you on the next one. See y'all bye. Music.